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GothiChild



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PostSubject: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 3:58 pm

Do you guys believe objects can be cursed or possessed by demons?

I know several christians near my town that won't buy from a certain handmade clothing store because they say the clothes are cursed. and trust me, they seemed really serious from that statement.

so what do you think?
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IronGuardian



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:11 pm

I do believe it is possible. While I don't think that all rock records and dungeons and dragons games have demons attached to them, I do think it is possible for demons to be sent into objects, and be able to influence the spiritual realm around them.

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Kamerad Ash



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:59 pm

"hell" yea.

Alot of Satanic Black Metal bands have cursed albums. That's the way they like it.
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Shamax



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:23 pm

Personally, I gotta say no, and it's my belief that attributing such power to an object is to create an idol in one's mind. To avoid it due to fear is to place it above God, who alone is to be feared reverentially. I know that's not "exactly" what you're asking, but (speaking solely of my personal experience, here) when people I've known start talking about places, people, or things that are "cursed" or some such, it's usually either someone taking a lot of liberties with the truth (and spinning some fantasical story) or someone who, while they *profess* Christ (usually more on the far charismatic fringe), their beliefs resemble dualism more than they do biblical Christianity.

Not trying to flame anyone. Just my personal belief and experience here. YMMV.
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SSG Jake



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:38 pm

No, I don't think so. I think the only way evil can effect you is through your own mind. I don't believe that he has the power to literally touch the physical world. Kinda the same reason I don't believe in Ghosts. If you're dead, you're dead. Heaven, Hell, Purgatory if you believe in that sort of thing, your'e somewhere else. Just randomly walking the earth, knocking over lamps, and knocking when some idiot with a TV camera asks, "Make your prescence known to us"? Not so much.
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Kan-o-sushi



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 7:42 pm

I possess many objects. Ha. Ha. Ha... Razz

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Kamerad Ash



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 7:48 pm

Shamax wrote:
Personally, I gotta say no, and it's my belief that attributing such power to an object is to create an idol in one's mind. To avoid it due to fear is to place it above God, who alone is to be feared reverentially. I know that's not "exactly" what you're asking, but (speaking solely of my personal experience, here) when people I've known start talking about places, people, or things that are "cursed" or some such, it's usually either someone taking a lot of liberties with the truth (and spinning some fantasical story) or someone who, while they *profess* Christ (usually more on the far charismatic fringe), their beliefs resemble dualism more than they do biblical Christianity.

Not trying to flame anyone. Just my personal belief and experience here. YMMV.

I believed the same as you Shamax, for a long time.. until I dabbled in sorcery and found out otherwise. I actually made some "cursed" objects via incantation back then and inadvertently. That did not end well!!

One has to understand what Curse here means. It is not like a Hollywood movie cursed item. It is simply an item that has been involved in some way in Demonic Malevolence and with Principalities of Darkness.. I don'[t want to go into details of how it is often done via actual magick. But yea. I remember I made a gateway for these forces to come through.. simply with a piece of paper., by drawing sygils on it and performing an incantation over it. ( shudders to even remember ).

Also, an item is cursed whever it is dedicate against God.. or is a tool against God.. to decieve.. wrap spiritual chains around someone etc. It is not Satan that necessariyl make it cursed, but God. God's wrath is upon such things. That was the worst part of my experience dabbling in sorcery.. is when I was in my final escape from it and in spritual warfare with a demon I had summoned... I felt God's wrath in a way I do not want to ever feel again.

Thank God I was saved from that abomination.

also, what is cursed to a believer.. is often a "blessing" to a Servant of the Devil.. because the Devil often grants those people power, money , influence and other things in exchange for your spreading of his message and enchantments.

Art that is dedicated to Satan is an enchantment. By it's very nature it is magick. A Spell. Because the power of Darkness is always first and foremost one of Enchantment and Seduction.. on a supernatural level.

And the person who is being hypnotized or enchanted NEVER knows he is being hypotized or enchanted. If he knew it.. it would not work very well. Hypnosis is something we are all under at one level or another, even as Christians.

But yea.. "cursed items can be understood this way too.

When we wear a Cross or some other Symbol of our Faith in Jesus.. it does not affect us in any bad way.. yet if a person dedicated to the service of Satan see's or handle's those same items.. that say. you as a devoted Christian owned or wore for many years.. well. it could make him ill.. both spiritually and physically. In this sense.. the power of objects is relative to the person who uses them.

In the same way.. what would be a cursed item for us and would offend the Holy Spirit in us, would not bother at all, a devoted follower of Darkness.

( sorry for my backwards sentence structure, I've been writing in German alot lately )


Last edited by Kamerad Ash on Wed Jul 21, 2010 8:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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GothiChild



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 8:14 pm

Is there any biblical stories about the subject? scratch *still confused*
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Kamerad Ash



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 8:16 pm

Well in the bible.. curses in family last for three generations. AS far as cursed objects.. I'm not sure if it deals with it anywhere directly. But is is a stretch to believe when we see the Wizards of Pharoah in the Old Testament turning their staffs into snakes.. and mimicking many of the miraculous feats that they witness of God's judgement. ?
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IronGuardian



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 8:42 pm

GothiChild wrote:
Is there any biblical stories about the subject? scratch *still confused*

People were possessed, and all idols and often anything owned by evil people were utterly destroyed, rather than reused.

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FireProphet



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Wed Jul 21, 2010 11:26 pm

IronGuardian wrote:
GothiChild wrote:
Is there any biblical stories about the subject? scratch *still confused*

People were possessed, and all idols and often anything owned by evil people were utterly destroyed, rather than reused.
And on the flipside, items are blessed in the Bible. Doesn't seem too much of a stretch to say they could be cursed by evil forces as well. Scriptural illustration of both forces at work through objects:

Exodus 7:10-12, "And Moses and Aaron went in unto Pharaoh, and they did so, as Jehovah had commanded: and Aaron cast down his rod before Pharaoh and before his servants, and it became a serpent.
Then Pharaoh also called for the wise men and the sorcerers: and they also, the magicians of Egypt, did in like manner with their enchantments.
For they cast down every man his rod, and they became serpents: but Aaron's rod swallowed up their rods."

For me the answer is really, "why not?"
A lot rides on your definition of curse, though. I get the sense that GothiChild and Shamax are both referring to people throwing around the term out of superstition, while Ash is referring to some serious intentional business.
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FuneralOath



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 7:40 am

I am going to take the middle ground here. Obviously some of you have not gone to Haiti or Paraguay, let alone Africa, and may not know what voodoo can do to certain objects, with all due respect. I've lived in Panama for 18 years of my life and have heard veritable stories of objects having a certain occultic energy. There are a lot of occult things here in Panama, much more than in the U.S But the promotion that there are "demons behind everything or even most things" is a hyper-Charismatic superstion perpetrated by people such as Bob Larson and his mentally incompetent followers, such as some of Gothichild's acquaintances.

Just so you know, I am a Reformed individual denominationally, and I know that there is a trend among Reformed people to shy away or even ignore the demonic. But we cannot do this as Christians. Demons, literally, are everywhere, as Ephesians 6 demonstrates. But they do not have too much to do with fixated objects or places, although it is within their power to "possess" them, per se.
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Kamerad Ash



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 7:51 am

FuneralOath wrote:
I am going to take the middle ground here. Obviously some of you have not gone to Haiti or Paraguay, let alone Africa, and may not know what voodoo can do to certain objects, with all due respect. I've lived in Panama for 18 years of my life and have heard veritable stories of objects having a certain occultic energy. There are a lot of occult things here in Panama, much more than in the U.S But the promotion that there are "demons behind everything or even most things" is a hyper-Charismatic superstion perpetrated by people such as Bob Larson and his mentally incompetent followers, such as some of Gothichild's acquaintances.

Just so you know, I am a Reformed individual denominationally, and I know that there is a trend among Reformed people to shy away or even ignore the demonic. But we cannot do this as Christians. Demons, literally, are everywhere, as Ephesians 6 demonstrates. But they do not have too much to do with fixated objects or places, although it is within their power to "possess" them, per se.

Nice post.

I know what you mean, Central and South American is full of alot of Occult energy, as you say. Alot of the ancestors of the Aztecs and other tribes from down there still continue on with alot of their old occultic traditions.
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trephining



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 7:59 am

Curses - This is superstiton, in scripture the only effective curses are those uttered by God. That a believer says that they have a certain curse put on them that is causing them to sin is no different than the way Adam tried to shift his blame for his sin to Eve.
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FuneralOath



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 8:30 am

trephining wrote:
Curses - This is superstiton, in scripture the only effective curses are those uttered by God. That a believer says that they have a certain curse put on them that is causing them to sin is no different than the way Adam tried to shift his blame for his sin to Eve.

I understand, but this is beside the point Smile
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trephining



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 8:47 am

Not really beside the point, because the original post asked if objects could be cursed/possessed and I assumed it was asked because of the example given: that if I wore cursed clothing, I would be more likely to be given over to sinful actions.

Or maybe I have read too much into it. Smile
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325ad



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 11:49 am

I think it is possible. Depends you the object or place and what happened their, or the intent of the object. I believe that places like Gettysburg Battlefield is haunted and games like Ouija Board are evil.

I also belive that it is wrong to play games suchs as Bloody Mary and the Summoning of the Bell Witch or other Demons thru the use of Goetic Invocation.

The Bible is clear on the these practices! Read Deuteronomy 18.
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olias



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:04 pm

GothiChild wrote:
Do you guys believe objects can be cursed or possessed by demons?

I know several christians near my town that won't buy from a certain handmade clothing store because they say the clothes are cursed. and trust me, they seemed really serious from that statement.

so what do you think?

This sounds like something made up, however I do believe that objects can have dark energies attached to them. But I don't think that there is really much to worry about. Like Phil said, it is very exaggerated by a lot of the really super fundie types (my words of course).
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psychopathologist



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:37 pm

Objects cannot be "possessed" or "cursed" in a literal sense.

This pastor in the 80s (I think it's the 80s) had a device that could play back what trees recorded, it had a lot to do with residency of the world, and how most objects can retain these vibrations, be it voices/curses or general bad "karma".


Then for example: "beds moving/shaking, doors just opening etc" This detective in the 60s wrote a book, and the book was about demonic possessions in prison inmates.

He had a room he would put the inmates in and ask specific questions etc...but this one inmate he brought in he decided to turn the lights off and sit him in front of this table, after maybe 5 minutes of sitting in the dark the table started violently shaking and the second that happened he flipped the lights on and saw "plasma" outside of his body coming from his belly button.
And when he flipped the lights it shot back into his stomach knocking the inmate to the floor and leaving a very large bruise.

Turns out the "Plasma" was actually lymphatic fluid.

Everything above is not a direct quote as i do not have the books infront of me
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Matt



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Fri Sep 03, 2010 7:53 am

I believe everything can be cursed,
but that doesn't mean curses can't be lifted, God is ald always will be the strongest party.
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Kamerad Ash



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:41 am

Matt wrote:
I believe everything can be cursed,
but that doesn't mean curses can't be lifted, God is ald always will be the strongest party.

Well.. yea. I believe God is responsible for most Curses.. not Satan. And if something is an abomination to Him, by it's very nature it is cursed. Whether it be deed or object.
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oldschooldoom



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:24 pm

Absolutely.

This is why we ask for The Lord's blessing when dedicating our children, home, church, etc. We are asking them to be blessed with the loving care and protection of our Maker.

I have listened to different people give testimony many times of "inheriting" the evil "problems" from previous owners. And I am not talking about buying a used Ford, LOL.
I'm talking about stuff that will make the hairs on your scalp raise up.

But I truly believe that all evil can be overcome by Good.
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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:01 am

Kamerad Ash wrote:
Matt wrote:
I believe everything can be cursed,
but that doesn't mean curses can't be lifted, God is ald always will be the strongest party.

Well.. yea. I believe God is responsible for most Curses.. not Satan. And if something is an abomination to Him, by it's very nature it is cursed. Whether it be deed or object.
God is indeed responsible for a lot of curses, and that sentence about something being an abomination is very well put!

Although there are ungodly curses as well, and I do believe there are more of them than you seem to agree with, but not necessarily all of them by "satan" (satan shouldn't be put on a pedestal, I believe demons as servants of the unholy have enough freedom to make their own decisions whether they want to possess something or not (story about Legoin and the horde of swines)), but I don't think we as followers should be afraid and steer away from it.

We are holy, and we have someone on our side who is "more than righteous" (take that in a both positive and negative way), so in essence I believe there are things we can do that are downright stupid, but in the end we are able to find protection by our Lord.

f.e. There is nothing benificial about entering on a "holy ground" somewhere in Thailand, having to take your shoes off and "obeying" their teachings. It's rude to the Lord to give that much credit to "another deity", but that doesn't mean that by entering (an obviously "possessed") place, as in "in the possession of another deity/demon", that you should give that demon the right to curse you, hell, we have the armor of God to protect us, and if we make stupid decisions, that armor will be there, if there is one power that needs more credit than it usually gets, it's God's.
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unblackberzerker



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Sat Oct 02, 2010 7:34 am

Do you think symbols like the cross, inverted cross, and pentagram have an inherent spiritual power in and of themselves? For example I really like the bands Summoning and Immortal, but they use inverted crosses/pentagrams in their logos. However, their lyrics really have nothing to do with Satan (especially Summoning). Does this mean that if I owned an album by these bands there could be a demonic presence in the house just because of these symbols, or does it only matter what the message is behind the symbol?

Kind of along the same line, the bands Burzum and Emperor have members that are either Satanists or Pagans. However, most of the lyrics are not blasphemous (Burzum's instrumental work, Dunkelheit; Emperor's later music, etc.). Because the members are a part of the occult, do you think that there is a demonic presence in their music?

These are just examples. It could be with artwork, movies, books, whatever.
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Death over Life



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PostSubject: Re: Can objects be cursed/possessed?   Sat Oct 02, 2010 4:52 pm

unblackberzerker wrote:
Do you think symbols like the cross, inverted cross, and pentagram have an inherent spiritual power in and of themselves? For example I really like the bands Summoning and Immortal, but they use inverted crosses/pentagrams in their logos. However, their lyrics really have nothing to do with Satan (especially Summoning). Does this mean that if I owned an album by these bands there could be a demonic presence in the house just because of these symbols, or does it only matter what the message is behind the symbol?

Kind of along the same line, the bands Burzum and Emperor have members that are either Satanists or Pagans. However, most of the lyrics are not blasphemous (Burzum's instrumental work, Dunkelheit; Emperor's later music, etc.). Because the members are a part of the occult, do you think that there is a demonic presence in their music?

These are just examples. It could be with artwork, movies, books, whatever.

I can answer that with a resounding NO.

If you wish to play this path, then to begin, the cross is a Pagan symbol, that has been twisted to give it a Christian meaning. The Inverted Cross originated from Christianity, which has been twisted to give a Satanic meaning. So, if these symbols were to have power, then there is within them, many different paradoxes and contradictions.

Let me take it a step further. Believe it or not, these symbols are popularly used in Christian bands and books as well. Some examples include Stryper, Divine Symphony, Cerimonial Sacred, the famous (or infamous for the conservatives) Possession, that Devout band, among quite a surprising few more. I remembered watching a Christian horror movie commercial, forgot what it was called, but at the end, the flashed a gargantuan pentagram at the end of the commercial, took up the whole screen as a matter of fact. So, if what you are thinking is True, then practically Catholicism, these Christian bands and artists, are full of paradoxes and contradictions. There is a serious problem with Christianity if what you are thinking, is True.

I have a bunch of artwork (Christians and Satanists alike) that have pentagrams, inverted crosses, crosses, crucifixes etc. and there is no form or sound of any kind of spiritual possession at all.

The Truth is, there is no symbolism within the symbols themselves. The only meanings and powers that it has are that which we give to it.

If I feel the right-side up cross is a Satanic symbol, then I give the cross the meaning that it is Satanic. If I give the inverted pentagram a Christian meaning, then it contains Christian powers and meaning. But none of this is born in the symbols themselves, only our minds and spirituality, what we give it.

It does say in Scriptures that nothing of itself is unclean, but that which we make unclean, to those people, it is unclean. That is from the words of Paul, who just wrote my entire post in 1 sentence.
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